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MUDII Forum Index General Chat So, where the hell are y'all?
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Author So, where the hell are y'all?
Gothik
cabalist

Joined: Aug 21, 2001
Posts: 61
From: London
Posted: 10-01-2002 20:48   
ffs, hope mudii.co.uk gets some new players soon...am not comfortable being accused of being useful or constructive. lol.

Looking forward to being my old cynacal, wiz abusing self once again..

Gothik


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Shantigh
friar

Joined: Aug 27, 2001
Posts: 84
From: Firkins
Posted: 11-01-2002 00:54   
lol, if my post was read and not taken offense and read for the points in it - it's fairly clear there is constructive points there, albeit obvious critiscism (sp) but for the main reason that although MUD2 is a fantasy land, it appears the people running it are living there full time.

Ok, now female-dog mode off. As long as people cut the nonsense and uppity behaviour, because I am posting in a manner which is blunt, and I'm good at that, but also in a way where I am just pointing out all the REALLY REALLY obvious things. Which surely I'm not the only one thinking!

On the work front - oh, I'm sure that a lot of work is going on behind the scenes, but work needs to be done on the price, or on something to make it attractive. Clients might do it, a bit of newbie help might do it - for 1 or 2 people, but it's certainly not mass appeal, or any sort of normal appeal.

Neither is advertising, that just wastes this hard earned cash reaped from the few players left. I also understand that the costs of the game restrict the price, but I also get this feeling, and I think I've got this feeling because someone told me, that the price was because of 2.com's price - and it is that price that scared away the majority of the players.

The fact is - MUD2 can attract a lot of players. Everyone remembers the anarchy filled WP days when the server was busy a lot of the time, now it's like walking into a morgue! Where a few lost souls breeze by every now and again. It's just not good, and before someone says "Oh and what would you suggest?" - I don't know what to suggest.

Working from the angle of someone who likes the game, and is watching its slow demise, I don't know how you could make it better, obviously, do something about the price if you wish to attract new players - and this isn't just because I can't afford it, it's because MANY people can't afford it. It's because it's too much for what the game has to offer, yes it's good, etc etc - but not at that price. I'm not going to repeat myself by going into the whole EQ vs MUD2 thing - but you all know it, so just think it right about... now.

It's also cyclic, get a good player base - with regular players (more than currently) and people will be attracted to the game, more people come to the game, they'll attract more etc. Have no people in the game, people turn up, empty server (at least as far as the mortal eye can see) and it's a turn off. No one to talk to or play with (which people do want - hence it being a MULTI player game), so they go away and don't come back. Of course, this is pointing out what everyone already knows, and probably doesn't need reminding of. Yet apart from the lack of players, the game in itself has become a turn off... and yes, wait, I can hear it being said. The Price.

So to close, as I have to somewhere or I'll write a novel. I'm not saying you aren't working hard, work away as hard as you can - from appearances, it's not doing much good - then again, of course I'll just be told, its things you can't see/are too come etc. I also realise fully that the cost of running the game dictates the price (ie, no tangents on that. It has been done to death) but perhaps a drop in the price, to get more players and more players would cover the losses you'd get with the price drop, might be an idea.

But other than that, since its clear I won't be listened too, or paid any heed since I'm just being all pessimistic and against the "oh we're doing fine" attitude, I'll just watch all these other, cheaper, prettier, newer, busier games dig MUD2's grave.

/rant off. Goodnight!


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Gothik
cabalist

Joined: Aug 21, 2001
Posts: 61
From: London
Posted: 11-01-2002 01:12   
What about a student discount, when i was a student i got a grant, no loans etc. Could be hard to verify who is a student but might attract some back?

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Eric
cleric

Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 134
From: Liverpool
Posted: 11-01-2002 02:52   
I thought my post was constructive to be honest.

Droo asked people's opinions and got them, and since opinions are personal there are bound to be some that aren't fluffy bunny-type posts.

The thing I don't understand is that if the price dictates the running costs of the game, how does this stop when if you half the price you will at least double the number of customers - I know at least 11 people (at a quick count) that would play for ?6, and it's good business sense to at least consider this option!

You've also got to consider what phoenix has that the other Mud servers don't - every business has to have a Unique Selling Point, and I can't see this ones.

Mud2.com's is that it's been around for donkeys years now, is stable, and the morts can be really really friendly here! You don't actually get pked as soon as you enter the land unless someone from the wireplay days is on

Speaking of wireplay, I would much rather share the kit between 49 other people than 1 - a full mud server was a truly fantastic thing, and provided probably the most fun times I've ever had on the game - I hope others would agree with that. The magical "Database 1 has been initialised" notice was amazing.

Wireplay had a USP - it was supported (somewhat) by the UK's largest Gaming Service Provider, by Wireplay and then Gameplay. Plus it was free in the end.

Summed up:

<@Fozzy`> it was the people that made it fun
<@Fozzy`> and they've gone
<@Fozzy`> so all ure left with is the game

Damn right. ;(


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Blitzen
novice

Joined: Jan 11, 2002
Posts: 1
Posted: 11-01-2002 03:08   
Salvadore here btw

I see your like ripping Fozzy's mIRC quotes then Eric

I'm not even gonna bother saying anything... cause its' already been said. Thought i'd just pop on and say hello.

Just one point... maybe getting some Quality information from somewhere would be a good idea. Maybe paying a bit for some of that would enable you to target an audience that would read over the entire email (or however you contact them).

Just a thought.

join #mudclan in mIRC on the quakenet server thing... << that allowed? Might meet someone you know,

Salvadore...err...ok... Blitzen

PS...here's another Fozzy quote:

<bah, had to remove it!>

[ This Message was edited by: Blitzen on 11-01-2002 03:13 ]


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Eric
cleric

Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 134
From: Liverpool
Posted: 11-01-2002 03:18   
Replaced it with this perhaps:

* @Fozzy sits in his gorilla suit sweating and..doing........you know...stuff





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Karya
Witch



Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 199
Posted: 11-01-2002 18:35   
I feel that there is the need to clear up a fairly important point about the charging system here at MUDII. The whole reason for charging what we do was made clear before Wireplay closed down and there have been many debates about it on various forums, but I think many people have forgotten, and of course newer players won't know the history.

This is a quote from the MUSE site:

MUSE is always on the look out for new partners to license the game, however it is of paramount importance that existing MUD2 sites are not unduly affected. If two versions of the game are equally readily available, players will simply migrate to the one which is the least expensive for them. Not only can this split the user base and cause neither game to flourish, it is grossly unfair to MUSE's existing licensees. MUSE prides itself on dealing honestly and fairly with its customers and licensees at all times.

That quote came from this page.

In short, when MUDII opened up on this site MUD2.com was already in operation and was already charging 12 pounds per month so we HAD to charge at least that amount. God knows we WANT to charge less, but we simply CANNOT! We've tried, but we can't.

If you have any queries about the above statement, please contact MUSE Ltd and not us, we're only the license holders.



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Gadget
friar

Joined: Dec 08, 2001
Posts: 88
Posted: 11-01-2002 20:56   
I'm a uni student with too much time on my hands, despite what people say, if i want i can afford ?12 a month, come on people thats one round of drinks, ONE godamnit. Advertise to students cus we got the time the computers and the connections. Secondly although we CAN afford ?12 how about a student cheap rate? (the logistics of that escape me) Student rate has a frenzy affect with me so try it. I love mud, but could you not put more options available in the accounts, instead of gettin first 6 hours free, howabout u can choose to pay the existing rate or a lesser rate depending upon the the maxium level u can reach (if u understand that) six hours for a newbie can be never getting above protector or yeoman, so no feel for the game, why should people pay for a game they don't know is any good?
Anyways the bars callin, mud is empty, as is my account balance.
Keep up the good work, btw, i've got a horse thats 20 years old hes still goin strong, and we dont have to flog him.



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Eric
cleric

Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 134
From: Liverpool
Posted: 12-01-2002 02:34   
Not all students are as lucky as you then mate.

I have a lot of upkeep to maintain, and ?12 is just not viable, this applies to other people too.

I can see the pricing structure is a bit stifled due to the licensing structure Karya, but can't you work in conjunction with .com and maybe come to an agreement beneficial to both?

Forgive my ignorance on this, as you might have already tried doing something like that.


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Karya
Witch



Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 199
Posted: 12-01-2002 10:26   
Yes, we have.

Btw, I was by no means trying to impy that your posts weren't constructive. I'm sorry if I gave that impression.


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Karya
Witch



Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 199
Posted: 13-01-2002 14:51   
On one of the previous posts someone mentioned something about wasting players' money on advertising costs. I had a feeling that this would come up as soon as advertising was mentioned so I think it's time to make something very clear on that point.

All advertising up until now (and the imediate future) has been paid out of a kitty called set-up costs. Set-up costs is a pool of money that Foddy and I put our own personal money into to pay for setting up Muddled Games Ltd, advertising and other costs.

Long term, advertising (along with event prizes and so on) is part of the cost of MUDII. Advertising is not, of course, a reason to charge a lot to play MUDII and this will never be used as a reason to justify its current cost.


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Brocken
novice

Joined: Jan 13, 2002
Posts: 5
Posted: 13-01-2002 16:27   
Wireplay recently relauched their service. Have you ever thought of asking them about hosting the game again?

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Foddy
Arch-Wizard



Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 138
Posted: 13-01-2002 16:48   
Quote:

On 13-01-2002 16:27, Brocken wrote:
Wireplay recently relauched their service. Have you ever thought of asking them about hosting the game again?


Brocken,

Wireplay hasn't quite relaunched their service yet - it's still in beta as far as I'm aware.

We are constantly on the look-out for opportunities which would be in the best interests of the game. Naturally, reestablishing a link with Wireplay is being considered.

While we all remember the good points of Wireplay, it's also important to remember that there were a number of bad points. Going backwards simply isn't an option.

As always, life is a lot more complex than it looks, and "hosting the game" is a broad concept. I can assure you that the game will not return to Wireplay as it was - the interests of our existing players and the game itself must come first. Of course, we may still come to some agreement with Wireplay.

Foddy


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Popculturemonkey
friar

Joined: Aug 26, 2001
Posts: 95
Posted: 13-01-2002 17:20   
Well, the old Mud2 forum is still up on their beta forums page.

Nice to see.

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Pop Culture Monkey: Jericho says: 'Pull My Finger'.

[ This Message was edited by: Popculturemonkey on 13-01-2002 17:21 ]


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Syl
protector

Joined: Sep 02, 2001
Posts: 13
From: Wolverhampton
Posted: 14-01-2002 16:41   
Hi to all those who i haven't seen in ages, I hope all of you are well.

Straight to business:

I'm not currently playing MUD at the moment for a number of reasons based on the fact i am a student:

1) I am on a proper degree unlike all those artist people out there (that was a joke before any hits out at me) and i have 20+hrs of lectures and (am meant to do) the same again in private study. I know this sounds like a sob story but my point is i don't have as much free time as i did at home and in my evening free times i prefer to socialise and go out for a drink or twenty-seven than sit at my computer. This is personal preference i know but it's just to say that my second point is important but not the only reason i don't play;

2) I can't afford it. With fees, living expenses and going out i am in my overdraft after just over one term at uni. I am lucky in that my parents pay accomodation but i don't want to pay ?12 a month for MUD. If it was ?6, for example, i may well be tempted to play in my free time.

A lower fee or a student rate might well convince me, as i sure it would many others who are already considering the game.

------------

Next I want to ask two questions that almost definitely have been asked in the last few months but i have missed or forgotten the answers:

1) Is there no way to confer with MUD2.com about the possibility of a reduction of fees on both servers? I haven't seen .com for quite a while but it wasn't buzzing with players last time i was on.

2) Wireplay was free even when it was opened up internationally, and therefore so was WPMUD2. I know that MUDII.co.uk is not WPMUD2 but how did Wireplay manage this? was it basically because (or so i think i was informed) bought the rights, in one form or another to MUD2? Or was it too difficult to stop them running MUD2 when wireplay went free?


Oh, one last question, is Umbrarg still anywhere near as involved with MUD2 as he was at Wireplay? Did he move to ArenaTek or whatever they are called?

Hope to see you all soon,

SYL

P.S - Does Richard still not have a release date for Hot Hotel? j/k
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Death to the dodgers of soap!


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Droo
Wizard



Joined: Jan 06, 2002
Posts: 43
From: Ireland, of course!
Posted: 14-01-2002 19:21   

You might find this interesting...

(sigh - turns on radio to hear 'Im thinking of the days..')

http://www.wireplay.com.au/scripts/Games.asp?GameID2=21&I=2

As for a return to wireplay, that might not be the most viable option. Do we really want another 'ground-zero' mud2?

Droo.


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Foddy
Arch-Wizard



Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 138
Posted: 14-01-2002 23:28   
Quote:

On 14-01-2002 16:41, Syl wrote:
A lower fee or a student rate might well convince me, as i sure it would many others who are already considering the game.


This is something which is a good idea, but hard to implement - how do we know who is and who isn't a student? What about the unemployed, or other groups who may also deserve a reduced rate?
Quote:

1) Is there no way to confer with MUD2.com about the possibility of a reduction of fees on both servers? I haven't seen .com for quite a while but it wasn't buzzing with players last time i was on.


For this to work, a price reduction would have to be beneficial for both sites. We've made enquiries in that direction, but (certainly for now at least) I'm afraid we can't reduce the price.
Quote:

2) Wireplay was free even when it was opened up internationally, and therefore so was WPMUD2. I know that MUDII.co.uk is not WPMUD2 but how did Wireplay manage this? was it basically because (or so i think i was informed) bought the rights, in one form or another to MUD2? Or was it too difficult to stop them running MUD2 when wireplay went free?


As I understand it, the relationship between Gameplay and MUSE was quite complex. Richard is in a much better position than me to answer this.
Quote:

Oh, one last question, is Umbrarg still anywhere near as involved with MUD2 as he was at Wireplay? Did he move to ArenaTek or whatever they are called?


Umbrarg is still around and involved, but not to quite the same extent as before. You'd better ask him if you want to know about his movements!

Have fun,

Foddy


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Umbrarg
Arch-Wizard



Joined: Aug 24, 2001
Posts: 1
Posted: 14-01-2002 23:40   
Quote:
On 14-01-2002 16:41, Syl wrote:

Oh, one last question, is Umbrarg still anywhere near as involved with MUD2 as he was at Wireplay? Did he move to ArenaTek or whatever they are called?



I'm still around, just in a more subtle and elusive way than before (no more new versions of MUD2 from me)! Lately, I've been the source of a number of strange objects and creatures which have a habit of materialising about the Land - the good ones that don't crash the game, anyway - and the odd quest that nobody ever notices is running unless I forcibly teleport them there . And yes, I'm working for ArenaTek.


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Droo
Wizard



Joined: Jan 06, 2002
Posts: 43
From: Ireland, of course!
Posted: 15-01-2002 17:07   

So, that just about wraps up this thread, stay tuned for more threads from Droo the wizard...

----*Droo:>


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Seamus
friar

Joined: Aug 23, 2001
Posts: 76
From: Newcastle upon Tyne
Posted: 18-01-2002 23:03   
Changing my profile, keeping my mud2 account alive when i'm at my old home.

<apologises for spam>

[ This Message was edited by: Seamus on 18-01-2002 23:05 ]


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